Falling Back to friendly territories in Draws

[Blane]

Hey Guys, I read up on the rules and I found something a little interesting: When 2 factions fight and end up in a draw result, BOTH banners retreat to an adjacent friendly tile.

Now my concern here is that it implies that even when defending, you leave your own territory when its a draw. I find this a little weird, but I wanted everyone's opinion on it. I think what it does is it adds a bonus to the attacking side(even in a draw, you push the guy back.), so it discourages just camping it out. The other is that it doesnt mean you lose the territory, it simply means you have move back into it the next turn...and possibly fight for it again. It also makes sense when 2 banners of different realms attack the same empty territory: they both fall back since no one actually was able to claim it in a draw.

I say we don't need to change it, but what do you guys think?

[Cowboy]

I dunno, it seems reasonable to me. I think if it's a draw it makes sense to have both move back, but you don't lose the territory.

[Blane]

Upon review, so did I. I think the best it to change it in game if it poses a huge amount of trouble. Besides, this was made in 6th ed when balance was more present in GW products. Should be good.

[Blane]

Upon review, it really works the way it is. In situations where 2 enemy banners attack the same empty territory, it only makes sense that neither of them should stay and claim it if it is a draw...so they fall back. Its all good.

[ftime]

however, if you are defending your own, and the opponent attacks your banner (that for example fortified itself, or chose to hold) and it's a draw, the defender doesn't move out: he stays put in that case.

[Blane]

Are you sure? I thought the rules clearly state that everyone involded in a draw falls back.

[ftime]

but logically, if you haven't 'lost' a battle, would you just give up your territory? I think if it is yours, and you don't lose (but neither win) then I don't think you should give up your position-it makes no sense to me.

But yeah, upon re-reading the rules, all ties/losses must retreat.. we could alter this though. I can see arguments made for both positions. Otherwise we could just ignore ties and simply look at actual point differentiation at the end of the battle...

Another alternative (but this is really going away from the original rules) is to keep the armies locked together in that territory till one does win. You could even force both parties to play out the next battle with only the 'left over' troops, unless another banner arrive nearby to add support. This could prove to be very interesting as well in an overall map strategy.

[Cowboy]

I think that the originally proposed strategy of not losing the territory, but still backing off seems to make sense.

[Blane]

Bah, I think that would be getting a little on the complicated side. I think the interpretation of the fall back move of both participants is perhaps that you have to fall back in order to regroup, gather more troops, etc., to then go back to reclaim the territory. Like I have said before, it prevents people from just camping in their fortified territories for extended periods of time, to some extend. Remember that you don't lose the territory, you simply have to move back into it next turn...at which point the enemy banner can do also. Upon revision, I think I would rather use the current rules, even though they seem counter-intuitive at first glance.

Blane

[stonebrow]

I dunno, I find it odd to move back if you didn't lose. Even if you don't lose the territory and its just your banner moving back I still find it doesnt make much sense for the defending army to move out of the territory. Its a bit too easy to move an enemy out of their territory if all you need is a tie. You guys have played enough games to know ties are quite frequent. I don't really see the problem if the player wants to "camp" on his territory with his banner, I mean if he camps he's not going out to attack other territories. You don't really win anything by just camping like that. Know what I mean?

[Cowboy]

you win momentum advantage. Now, I can choose to attack into your territory, despite not winning my battle, and thus press my advantage. Sure, if you move back into my territory we pass in the night, but worse case scenario I'm re defending my territory, and otherwise, I'm attacking yours as though, I had won the last battle.

[drdanimalsize]

Keep the rules as they are since we havent played any games yet.

[stonebrow]

I agree with that. We should just play the campaign as its written and not change anything. We haven't even started the d**n thing and already you guys wanna change stuff.

[Blane]

Discussion never hurt anyone.

[stonebrow]

I never said it did lol. All I'm saying is that we should give the campaign a go as it is and then we can figure out all the little things that don't seem to work well or that cause problems and fix them for a customized campaign afterwards.